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Author Topic: New Railway Lines  (Read 3114 times)

Offline kaykayt

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New Railway Lines
« on: November 22, 2015, 04:07:05 PM »
Any suggestions where the next railway extension should take place? Such as the missing link to Flagstone/Yarrabilba.

Offline kaykayt

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #1 on: November 22, 2015, 05:00:51 PM »
https://www.google.com/maps/d/edit?mid=zu6iTZ6TGTA4.kBZI2d97QRD4&usp=sharing

just a concept

Offline ozbob

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #2 on: November 22, 2015, 05:05:00 PM »
A good question ^

I think we really need to future proof what we have first before further extensions.  We are struggling with inner capacity and that must be resolved first.  A second rail route through the core CBD is needed with flow on improvements for capacity north and south particularly.
Money would be better invested in ATP (improved signalling etc.) and further track amplifications eg. Beerburrum - Landsborough North, Southern line. Redbank Plains south is one extension (from Springfield Central) that is probably feasible in the near future.
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Offline ozbob

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #3 on: November 22, 2015, 05:07:43 PM »
https://www.google.com/maps/d/edit?mid=zu6iTZ6TGTA4.kBZI2d97QRD4&usp=sharing

just a concept

Nice!  Will be needed one day.
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Offline verbatim9

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #4 on: November 22, 2015, 05:36:25 PM »
Yeah but hopefully through to Beaudesert

Offline James

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #5 on: November 22, 2015, 05:45:14 PM »
Such a railway line will be needed one day - personally I prefer a Class B busway/railway line extending down from Altandi along Pinelands Rd/Beaudesert Rd/Mount Lindsay Highway as it is more visible, accessible and will also help absorb CBD-bound trips, meaning routes like the 130/140/150 can be feederised into the railway line/Griffith Uni busway instead of proceeding to the CBD.
Is it really that hard to run frequent, reliable public transport?

Offline kaykayt

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #6 on: November 22, 2015, 06:04:41 PM »
I just found out Logan Villiage, Jimboomba and Beaudesert could be connect to Bethania Station (station before Altandi) instead of Salisbury.
Which connection is better?

Offline kaykayt

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #7 on: November 22, 2015, 06:11:19 PM »
Made Adjustments
https://www.google.com/maps/d/edit?mid=zu6iTZ6TGTA4.kBZI2d97QRD4&usp=sharing

Offline aldonius

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #8 on: November 22, 2015, 07:16:48 PM »
Via Salisbury is better by far.

The alignment coming out of Bethania to the southwest is terrible and should not be used for a modern railway. The alignment to the north of Bethania is also pretty bad in a number of places.

Also, a shorter shared section can only mean less congestion between the various lines (and it's less expensive to upgrade if required).

Flagstone to the City via CRR should be time-competitive with driving. Currently, transit takes twice as long.

Offline SurfRail

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #9 on: November 22, 2015, 10:12:04 PM »
I can't see that you would ever need to build the railway past the Flagstone area (Undullah I think would be a park and ride station just after Flagstone Central).

There isn't really any rail fix for Yarrabilba short of respectable bus services feeding into Beenleigh and eventually Flagstone.

The stations locations in the Salisbury to Beaudesert study looked reasonable, but I would look at ironing out some of the kinks in the existing rail alignment north of Bromelton - for instance the big "bump" around Paradise Rd, and straightening the alignment between Greenbank and Parkinson where possible (there was at least one possible deviation just north of the Logan Motorway marked on UBDs for some years).
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Offline kaykayt

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #10 on: November 23, 2015, 08:03:15 PM »
This is should be a route after CRR and beaudesert line.
 :-t

https://www.google.com/maps/d/edit?mid=zu6iTZ6TGTA4.k0oCnCRHIrs8&usp=sharing

Offline verbatim9

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #11 on: November 23, 2015, 09:55:31 PM »
As Light Rail for sure Surface dual guage sleepers from Corinda to Indooroopilly then driven tunnel to UQ. Can be the start of a 20 billion dollar  Light rail/Metro Project for Brisbane

Offline #Metro

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #12 on: November 23, 2015, 10:00:21 PM »
Happy to  hear whatever ideas, just note there is already a perfectly good busway to UQ.
Negative people... have a problem for every solution.
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Online OzGamer

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #13 on: November 24, 2015, 08:12:20 AM »
Just a question - why would you duplicate or replace the existing rail service between Corinda and Indooroopilly? That is a fast, frequent, effective service. If you were to extend the light rail/metro out from Indooroopilly why not send it westward? Even one station west would add more value than four stations duplicating the existing heavy rail service.

Offline verbatim9

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #14 on: November 24, 2015, 08:21:22 AM »
Yeah I would like it to go Westward Indooroopilly  shopping town, Indooroopilly State School, Chapel Hill, Kenmore Tavern, Terminate Kenmore Village.

Offline SurfRail

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #15 on: November 24, 2015, 08:39:34 AM »
Happy to  hear whatever ideas, just note there is already a perfectly good busway to UQ.

It would be a lot more perfectly good if it could be connected to Chancellor's Place and some services throughrouted to Indooroopilly and the west - even just using the road network around the southern perimeter of the campus.
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Offline James

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #16 on: November 24, 2015, 08:48:38 AM »
It would be a lot more perfectly good if it could be connected to Chancellor's Place and some services throughrouted to Indooroopilly and the west - even just using the road network around the southern perimeter of the campus.

I hate to say it SR, but that ring road around the bottom of campus is nasty. 30km/h speed limit, narrow (particularly with cars parked on both sides), speed bumps everywhere and the ring road takes a circuitous routing. Good luck getting UQ to comply as well. My preference would be just to put in a busway tunnel between UQ and Indro, with a few stations in between. Of course this wouldn't be built until 2050 at the earliest (or something ridiculous like that).

Also: is that proposed alignment a Metro or CRR2? Just generally, I think we should leave the northern busway alone, and leave it as part of a North-SE busway trunk which runs more like a railway line (but with long buses instead).
Is it really that hard to run frequent, reliable public transport?

Offline ozbob

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #17 on: January 30, 2016, 03:20:22 AM »
Enough is Enough. Brisbane Crying Out for Urban Rail Investment

>> https://brisbanedevelopment.com/enough-is-enough-brisbane-crying-out-for-urban-rail-investment/
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Offline ozbob

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #18 on: January 30, 2016, 06:08:42 AM »
^

Brisbane does bus badly at present (some exception with busway)  but overall utter shambles.  No wonder people are chomping at the bit for rail in all its guises.  Rail is needed, but sorting out what we have now will help ...  :P

Longer term rail must be in the mix. CRR is the immediate priority for Brisbane, and ATP.

Expensive bus infrastructure is not needed, reform of the network is.
« Last Edit: January 30, 2016, 06:56:14 AM by ozbob »
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Offline QLDBUS

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #19 on: January 30, 2016, 09:37:13 AM »
Why aren't we focused on fixing the current network and more focused on build lines out to flagstone and extensions to Springfield which lead to the middle of nowhere we should be fixing on what he have now like the beenleigh  line which can't even handle more than a 30 minute frequency both beenleigh and Gold Coast lines are well over due for 15 minute off peak frequency and what about the Sunshine Coast line duplication that should of been done 5 years ago the Sunshine Coast line should at least have a 30 minute off peak frequency and instead of focusing on corridors which have no demographic and population focuse on ones which do like varsity lakes to coolongatta exstention or cross river rail and the duplication of manly to cleveland which all have major demographics

Priorities


1. Sunshine Coast line duplication (2016)
2. Beenleigh line duplication (2017)
3. Cross river rail (2017-2018 ready for queens wharf)
4. Cleveland line duplication( 2018)
5. beerwah to caloundra line(2019) AND then Light rail from caloundra to maroochydore
6. springfield line extension(2019-2020)
« Last Edit: January 30, 2016, 11:33:45 AM by QLDBUS »

Offline Gazza

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #20 on: January 30, 2016, 10:07:36 AM »
I'd rather see a Trouts Rd line ahead of any Brisbane LRT.
But otherwise, that list is a good sequence of priorities.

In terms of Greenfield lines, in the medium term I think a line to Caloundra, and an extension to Redbank plains are both reasonable and aren't expensive to do.

Offline Arnz

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #21 on: January 30, 2016, 11:29:53 AM »
CRR, NCL Beerburrum to Landsborough duplication, plus other track amplifications (Beenleigh & Cleveland) would be ahead in priority IMO. Trouts Road would be medium to long term expansion.

The only part of LR where I can see it working on the SC is the Maroochydore to Mooloolaba being the initial stage, with Mooloolaba to Kawana Shoppingworld and/or SCUPH being the 2nd stage.

CAMCOS, unfortunately is the new "Redcliffe line", coupled with most of the seats being traditional conservative territory apart from Kawana, Glasshouse and Noosa having experienced being Labor seats at one point.  Chances are you'd see 20 Maglev Buses to Caboolture and 10 Maglev Buses to Doomben before any form of Heavy Rail on the CAMCOS corridor to the Sunshine Coast is introduced.
Rgds,
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Offline STB

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #22 on: January 30, 2016, 11:55:05 AM »
Happy to  hear whatever ideas, just note there is already a perfectly good busway to UQ.

It would be a lot more perfectly good if it could be connected to Chancellor's Place and some services throughrouted to Indooroopilly and the west - even just using the road network around the southern perimeter of the campus.

Eh, the UQ Senate voted, the UQ Senate got what they wanted.   Like  James said, it's going to be an awfully long time before that chestnut is revisited.

Offline STB

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #23 on: January 30, 2016, 12:16:44 PM »

Priorities


1. Sunshine Coast line duplication (2016)
2. Beenleigh line duplication (2017)
3. Cross river rail (2017-2018 ready for queens wharf)
4. Cleveland line duplication( 2018)
5. beerwah to caloundra line(2019) AND then Light rail from caloundra to maroochydore
6. springfield line extension(2019-2020)

I generally agree with that list, although I'm not sure what those dates mean, there's no way that those dates of construction starting will happen.

My list in order would be as follows (excluding GCLR).

1. Cross River Rail
2. Sunshine Coast Duplication
3. CAMCOS to Maroochydore.
4. Beenleigh line quaduplication (Yeerongpilly to Kuraby) and Triplication from Kuraby to Beenleigh.
5. Gold Coast Line extension to Coolangatta
6. Cleveland Line Duplication (Manly to Cleveland)
7. Trouts Road Line
8. Springfield Line extension to at least Yamanto (subject to the development of Ripley Valley).

And with that list, you're probably looking at least 30 years of construction time.

Offline SurfRail

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #24 on: January 30, 2016, 01:40:28 PM »
I would put the Springfield extension further up the list, and I don't know that you would need to bother with additional tracks anywhere further south of Loganlea.  If you did, you would make a point of not building additional platforms at any stations except Kuraby (additional fourth platform), Loganlea (additional third and fourth platforms) and Beenleigh (see below).

Ideally I would examine realigning Trinder Park at the same time, and at replacing Trinder Park with an interchange/park and ride at Compton Road. 

Beenleigh needs to be moved further south and given 4 platforms, and the yard reconfigured to accommodate that.  (Could be dock platforms in the middle for Beenleigh services, other than those entering the yard which would still terminate on the outside on platform 1.  That would enable a single concourse below the line and avoid the need for 2-3 extra lifts.)

All of that would need to accommodate what happens with Gold Coast services in the longer run.  Continuing these anywhere further north than the immediate surrounds of Beenleigh on the existing alignment is already an act of compromise, and you would only need 2 tracks south of Kuraby if these ever go a different way, so caution needs to be taken not to create a big stranded investment.
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Offline Arnz

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #25 on: January 30, 2016, 02:36:47 PM »
Quadding from Strathpine to Lawnton (start of the 4 track newly opened North Pine Bridge), as well as triplicating from Petrie to Narangba (along with relocating Dakabin station slightly north of the existing location around the corner of Thompson Road and Alma Road) is a suggested long term option. 

The quadding from Strathpine to Lawnton to prepare ahead for Trouts Road, plus increased freight paths for both the Strathpine-Lawnton Quadding and Tripling between Petrie to Narangba (which Narangba already has 3-tracks and a 3-platform station), plus solves the Dakabin issue with a new basic 3-platform station and bus interchange (no fancy overengineering like Narangba is required, although there would be roadworks required around the proposed location).
« Last Edit: January 30, 2016, 03:04:05 PM by Arnz »
Rgds,
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Offline ozbob

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #26 on: January 30, 2016, 02:50:28 PM »
Queensland Rail, despite all its alleged faults has the best track in the nation.

Here is a happy snap at Goodna.  Note the straight rails, the sleepers, the bridge protection.  It shames the other states.

I was standing on Caulfield platform recently and I was horrified at the shambolic state that Metro has allowed.

Thank you Queensland Rail. Timetables might not be perfect (yet) but thank you all for the quality track.



Photograph R Dow 29th January 2016
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Offline ozbob

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #27 on: January 30, 2016, 03:13:55 PM »
Oh yeah .. of all the lines in SEQ, the good ol' Ippy carries the heaviest tonnage overall ..

WDYSAT ?

(thank goodness it is 1st class infrastructure)  bring on the Ippy flyers!!

Here is one ... lol



R Dow 30 July 2015
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Offline ozbob

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #28 on: January 30, 2016, 03:22:46 PM »
Goodna to Gailes ... on the fly!



R Dow 30 July 2015

Best quality track this ..

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Offline ozbob

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #29 on: January 30, 2016, 03:30:56 PM »
Sherwood to Indro .. Yee haa!!  :-*



R Dow 30th July 2015
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Offline ozbob

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #30 on: January 30, 2016, 03:40:30 PM »
Normanby to Central by steam ..

This was a live thing, so not the best but hey .. history!!



30th July 2015 R Dow
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Offline SurfRail

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #31 on: January 30, 2016, 03:48:47 PM »
Queensland Rail, despite all its alleged faults has the best track in the nation.

Increasingly I have trouble believing that.  Perth is definitely better, and every time I've visited Sydney since around 2012 I get that impression as well.  I haven't ridden around Adelaide extensively since the network renewal was completed but I would expect similar.

It's definitely better than Melbourne, no doubt.

QR has a problem in resting on its laurels though.  Definitely don't want to encourage that.
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Offline ozbob

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #32 on: January 30, 2016, 04:04:04 PM »
Perth has it relatively easy. No serious freight on top ...

Adelaide is an isolated network now.

Sydney, chronic issues with failure.  Just follow their twitter feeds etc.'

Melbourne. Basket case.

The thing that causes issue here in the main is the telemetry failures, bridge and crossing strikes.
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Offline petey3801

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #33 on: January 30, 2016, 04:05:21 PM »
Yeah, certainly better than Melbourne, but I think the others have it over us! Sydney is quite good now-a-days. Perth is quite good, even compared to Shorncliffe and Ferny Grove, although those two have gotten better than it was now that contrete re-sleepering has been done.
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Offline ozbob

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #34 on: January 30, 2016, 04:07:43 PM »
Yeah, certainly better than Melbourne, but I think the others have it over us! Sydney is quite good now-a-days. Perth is quite good, even compared to Shorncliffe and Ferny Grove, although those two have gotten better than it was now that contrete re-sleepering has been done.

No, disagree strongly.

Later qualification Petey. You are right, wrt to the Shorncliffe and Ferny Grove with the concrete sleepers. Hey I remember when the steel ones used to cook on a warm day hey?  I saw a pic the other day of a sleeper on fire at Richmond (vic) .. wtf ?

Metro is ripping the whole system off.  The stupid V. government has yet to grasp the root problem .. although I have suggested to them many times over the last few days ...
« Last Edit: January 30, 2016, 07:03:17 PM by ozbob »
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Offline ozbob

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #35 on: January 30, 2016, 04:19:53 PM »
Adelaide was very interesting.  The subs are 5'3 ' but the sleeper replacements are all keyed for 4' 8.5" as well as the current track.

I am lead to believe that if .. and it is a big IF, all lines get sparked, then it will go 4' 8.5" ..

It will probably depend on how the fed stuff goes I expect. But everyone should visit Adelaide and ride on the motors. It. is. grouse. !
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Offline ozbob

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #36 on: January 30, 2016, 06:25:48 PM »
Last time I was Sydney  there were issues but mainly due to freight fukups. But progressively they are separating freight from pax. An advantage that we do not have yet in Brisbane for the main lines.

Opal is neat!!  Cheap as chips too, but it works really well. No issues from me, other than that it is a very flawed fare structure ( not the card itself )  however IPART has indicated the days of ' wine and roses ' is coming to a conclusion ...   :fp:
« Last Edit: January 30, 2016, 06:31:57 PM by ozbob »
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Offline ozbob

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #37 on: January 30, 2016, 06:33:56 PM »
By the way, Adelaide fares are very sensible and equitable.

Melbourne.  Total cluster fuk.
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Offline James

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #38 on: January 30, 2016, 07:36:19 PM »
I think it is probably smarter separating these into 'minor' and 'major' infrastructure projects.

Minor Infrastructure Priorities:
1. Sunshine Coast duplication
2. Sandgate - Shorncliffe duplication
3. Manly - Cleveland duplication
4. Four tracks + realignment from Salisbury to Kuraby

Major Infrastructure Priorities:
1. Cross River Rail
2. Trouts Rd corridor (CRR1 portal to Strathpine)
- As a note to this one, the Trouts Rd line should be built at the same time as the ring road/motorway from Toowong to Carseldine (necessary long term to allow all trucks and non-Brisbane bound vehicles to bypass the Brisbane metro area a la the Gateway)

Aside from that, I think there should be an investigation as to whether it is beneficial having the Gold Coast line take over the SE busway and run up to Brisbane along the motorway, or use the existing Beenleigh line alignment. I fear without a rail line to the GC which isn't competitive with the car even in the off-peak, we are going to see an M1 in 20-30 years time which more resembles Canada's Highway 401 (the one which passes through Toronto with about 8 lanes each way at its peak).
Is it really that hard to run frequent, reliable public transport?

Offline ozbob

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Re: New Railway Lines
« Reply #39 on: January 30, 2016, 07:41:43 PM »
Good thinking James.

Thank you.
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