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What should happen to Dutton Park Station?

Keep it
3 (13%)
Ditch it
20 (87%)

Total Members Voted: 21

Voting closed: December 04, 2013, 01:50:54 PM

Author Topic: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.  (Read 6161 times)

Offline #Metro

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Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« on: November 27, 2013, 01:50:54 PM »
What should happen to Dutton Park Station?


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Offline #Metro

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #1 on: November 27, 2013, 01:53:51 PM »
Also, does anyone have the full image of the letter partially shown at the below link?

http://blogs.abc.net.au/queensland/2013/11/campaign-to-save-dutton-park-station.html
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Offline Gazza

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #2 on: November 27, 2013, 03:14:18 PM »
Ditch it, with a bridge from the PA Cycleway across to Peter Doherty St http://goo.gl/maps/D2UUS

When you are there in person, there is a clear line of sight between the urban village and the PA, but what is utterly lacking is a ped link:
http://goo.gl/maps/cM5LO

Annoying me that this issue is taking attention away from the lack of underground platforms at Park Road.

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #3 on: November 27, 2013, 03:38:00 PM »
I'm disappointed that Spencer didn't push to Scott that there was no Park Road station planned for Beenleigh and Gold Coast line passengers.  Yes, they keep saying about a bridge from Park Road station to the PA Hospital (which IMO I think is a waste when you have the busway right there going to PA Hospital from Park Road station already), but that still doesn't help Beenleigh and Gold Coast line passengers as there is nothing in the plans yet for an underground Park Road station to give that link to the PA Hospital, among other locations and other train lines.

Offline Jonno

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #4 on: November 27, 2013, 09:36:41 PM »
Public transport failing at around 8-9% of all trips and were going to remove a station and make it less accessible!!!! Time we wake up to ourselves!! We are stumbling at under 10% of trips whilst overseas is heading upwards if 30-40%.  We are the laughing stock of transport planning!!

This BUM tunnel is a complete joke!!! Time to keep CRR lite!!

Offline Gazza

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #5 on: November 27, 2013, 09:42:13 PM »
Quote
Public transport failing at around 8-9% of all trips and were going to remove a station and make it less accessible!!!!
That's faulty logic though, especially since there are really good alternatives nearby with better frequency.

The number of stations does not necessarily correlate directly with the attractiveness of a system, if that were the case then a system with stops every 100m would be 8 times more popular than a system with stops every 800m.

The experience in Perth, and other cities, is that once your stop spacing gets to close the people you gain through extra stations are lost due to the excessive journey times created...The 65 minute journey from Beenleigh is not attractive due to the large numbers of stops.
Brisbane (Like Melbourne and Sydney) is hamstrung with a legacy rail network that was built for the steam era, not modern travel needs.

Dutton Park, along with Gailes and Wynnum actually harm the network more than they help it.

Offline Jonno

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #6 on: November 27, 2013, 09:48:25 PM »
It is right next to a major employment hub. All urban design, town planning & transport planning principles dictates a station here!  I guess the North Lakes station on the MBRL 100 meters south of a major retail/employment centres is fantastic because it allows faster trains. 

We keep making poor transport design decision and pat ourselves on the back for a whopping 9%!!!

Offline #Metro

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #7 on: November 27, 2013, 09:57:21 PM »
Quote
Public transport failing at around 8-9% of all trips and were going to remove a station and make it less accessible!!!! Time we wake up to ourselves!! We are stumbling at under 10% of trips whilst overseas is heading upwards if 30-40%.  We are the laughing stock of transport planning!!

This BUM tunnel is a complete joke!!! Time to keep CRR lite!!



The more stops there are, the slower services will be.
PA Hospital has a brand new busway station with full DDA access and full high frequency services. These buses (66, 169, 139, 209) also go to Park Road station every few minutes. There is the BUZ 100 across the road and the BUZ 196 on the Dutton Park side as well. Removing the station will remove maintainence and labour costs from the system as well.

In a rare sight, I agree with STB and Gazza on this one. CUT.
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Offline Gazza

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #8 on: November 27, 2013, 10:23:28 PM »
Quote
It is right next to a major employment hub.
Right, so why does it get 1/4 of the passenger movements of Park Rd, 600m away?

Boggo Rd Urban Village is where the good urban planning is.

Offline SurfRail

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #9 on: November 27, 2013, 10:44:30 PM »
Putting a station "next" to something is irrelevant if:
- the platforms are not DDA compliant
- station access is not DDA compliant
- sightlines are poor creating safety issues
- no decent pedestrian access to the PA Hospital or the affiliated organisations there like TRI, despite being "next to" the station
- services are infrequent and slow

There is a distinction between transit oriented development like the Boggo Road Ecosciences Precinct and transit adjacent development like the BCC business centre at Yeerongpilly.  Putting something next to a railway, or keeping a station open, doesn't mean you will get a good outcome.  The patronage figures are quite telling.

So yes - I'm all for removing Dutton Park.  It's one thing I love about this forum - the ability to discuss these issues and hold views like this is what sets us apart from other lobby groups which sook and create FUD and achieve nothing.  Spock Factor wins.

Ms Trad has screwed up again by focusing on a tertiary or even a quaternary issue, rather than the bigger problem of her constituents not being able to get to UQ or the Cleveland line without a double transfer or going considerably out of their way to the Gabba.
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Offline #Metro

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #10 on: November 27, 2013, 11:27:51 PM »
I spew on Jakie Trad's letter. Enough Said.

Dutton Park looks like something out of Wacol Prison. It is sunken and under a bridge so it is a mugger's dream.

Fed up with the BS that masquerades as "concern". Jackie Trad, Milton Dick, Peter Matic and Lord Mayor, go HOME!!
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STB

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #11 on: November 27, 2013, 11:32:33 PM »
I spew on Jakie Trad's letter. Enough Said.

Dutton Park looks like something out of Wacol Prison. It is sunken and under a bridge so it is a mugger's dream.

Fed up with the BS that masquerades as "concern". Jackie Trad, Milton Dick, Peter Matic and Lord Mayor, go HOME!!

I concur.  I'm surprised that she's so focused on this one station, when the bigger station with the key interchanges to various key locations and rail lines is missing an underground platform for Beenleigh/Gold Coast line passengers, ie: Park Road, should be the one she should be focusing on.  Is any lights on in her brain, or has her brain wandered off somewhere?

Offline ozbob

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #12 on: November 28, 2013, 06:41:22 AM »
This was my immediate response to the radio station yesterday early morning, and was read out by Spencer Howson ...

Half baked projects, have long term consequences ...
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Offline Jonno

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #13 on: November 28, 2013, 07:35:03 AM »
Agree totally with comments regarding Jackie Trad and City Hall, however the reason below should be reasons to upgrade not remove!
Putting a station "next" to something is irrelevant if:
- the platforms are not DDA compliant
- station access is not DDA compliant
- sightlines are poor creating safety issues
- no decent pedestrian access to the PA Hospital or the affiliated organisations there like TRI, despite being "next to" the station
- services are infrequent

We all know the patronage killers are frequency, lack of cross-city services, poor bus-rail connectivity cost and oversupply of parking

Just feel like we are picking on the station becuse the network doesn't support it. It should be upgraded, the network built to handle better/more expresses and the surrounding area developed as a TOD without question!


I just can't support removing a station when overall mode split is less than 10%!

What we call foam 'leading sustainable cities' call next years projects!

I also think the BUM is going to deliver an non-future proof rail network!
« Last Edit: November 28, 2013, 07:41:28 AM by Jonno »

Offline #Metro

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #14 on: November 28, 2013, 07:50:46 AM »
Quote
We all know the patronage killers are frequency, lack of cross-city services, poor bus-rail connectivity cost and oversupply of parking

This is very true. Add cost (of production of services) and cost (of purchasing services - fares) in there as well.

Quote
Just feel like we are picking on the station becuse the network doesn't support it. It should be upgraded, the network built to handle better/more expresses and the surrounding area developed as a TOD without question!

Park Road has undergone massive upgrade with a busway connection. Dutton Pk would never come close to this. You mean to say BUM would not allow better/more expresses? The area does not need to be developed as a TOD because it already is with the Hospital and TRI next to it. The airspace above Park Road station could be developed as it is a very attractive location and have excellent mobility from there (four rail destinations - city, cleveland, beenleigh/ferny grove, airport/gold coast plus all busway connections) and is in Wooloongabba which there is great demand for housing. There may be issue with local NIMBY reaction but, the opportunity is there.

The fact that Dutton Pk is also located under a bridge also restricts what can be done to upgrade the station. You can't really build above it because above it is a roadway.

Quote
What we call foam 'leading sustainable cities' call next years projects!
It's not the city which drives investment. It is private industry. It's not the gov't that is building The Milton, for example, developers are on behalf of people who don't live there but would like to. The best they can do is have less restrictive planning permissions and charge less upfront development fees so that it is easy to start development projects.
Quote
I also think the BUM is going to deliver an non-future proof rail network!

Perhaps. Given that BT is behind the controls, I think we should be on the lookout of critical design restrictions they may want to slip in there to entrench themselves and their bus operations - i.e. make the technical standards of the tunnel so steep, narrow or weak that rail is ruled out as a future option.
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Offline ozbob

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #15 on: November 28, 2013, 10:22:07 AM »
I don't think anyone is really pleased that stations may go.  The reality is this, they intend to build the tunnel portal around Dutton Park.  Simply is not the room under this present plan.  The LNP government does not want to widen the corridor through property resumptions so station goes.  If that is the practical cost so be it.  Dutton Park is not that handy to PA Hospital in actuality.  It has a busway station which is a better option. I hope they can come up with a UBAT station at Park Road, this would then make it much better overall.

It may turn out that more studies may suggest that another location might be better for the portal. If that is the case then perhaps Dutton Park might remain.
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Offline SurfRail

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #16 on: November 28, 2013, 10:47:43 AM »
There are considerable network advantages to getting rid of Dutton Park - principally that all services Fairfield and south can use the tunnel, which creates more capacity for Cleveland trains and a faster journey time.  Will also allow Park Road to be reconfigured to get rid of the curvature, reduce the number of platforms to what is actually needed, and eliminate junction conflicts by sending the crossing trains underneath.  I can see no reason why you would need to run any trains from south of Fairfield via South Bank any longer with UBAT, which is a small advantage over CRR.
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Offline #Metro

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #17 on: November 28, 2013, 11:34:10 AM »
It's just history repeating. Nobody is still upset that Gloucester St railway station (closed 1978) or Nyanda stations on the Beenleigh line were closed. Both stations were terminated from the network as a result of (wink wink) longer trains requiring longer platforms.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gloucester_Street_railway_station

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nyanda_railway_station

The Beenleigh line is an old 1800s style railway line with too many stations, windy curves everywhere (didn't have the equipment to dig it straight as we do today)

I hope that ALL Beenleigh trains and ALL GC trains use the new tunnel so that the Cleveland line is exclusively the train service that runs CBD-Southbank-Cleveland. This will remove junction conflicts and may even allow even more services to be put on all day.

I fully support the elimination of Dutton Park station. Time to move past instinctual loss aversion reactions, step back and look at the big picture.
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Offline James

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #18 on: November 28, 2013, 11:37:49 AM »
We all know the patronage killers are frequency, lack of cross-city services, poor bus-rail connectivity cost and oversupply of parking

Just feel like we are picking on the station becuse the network doesn't support it. It should be upgraded, the network built to handle better/more expresses and the surrounding area developed as a TOD without question!


I just can't support removing a station when overall mode split is less than 10%!

What we call foam 'leading sustainable cities' call next years projects!

I also think the BUM is going to deliver an non-future proof rail network!

Removing stations may not necessarily decrease patronage.

Lets look at the options of someone living on the entrance of Dutton Park station (off-peak weekdays) going to South Brisbane/Cultural Center:
RAIL:
Dutton Park
- 15 minutes (average) waiting
- 8 minutes trip time
Total average trip time: 23 minutes
Park Road
- 10 minutes walk
- 5 minutes (bus)/10 minutes (train) waiting time (either bus or train)
- 5 minutes (train)/9 minutes (bus)
Total average trip time:
Around 25 minutes for both.

BUSWAY:
PA Hospital:
- 9 minutes walk
- 5 minutes average waiting time
- 8 minute trip
Total trip time: 22 minutes

BUS STOP:
Annerley Rd at Cemetery, stop 13/18
- 3 minutes walk
- 7.5 minutes average wait (196)
- 12 minutes travel time
Total trip time: 23 minutes

Overall, by closing Dutton Park station, at worse, pax travelling to stations along the Beenleigh line who are not mobile enough to walk to Park Road will be the only ones significantly affected, possibly facing journey time increases of up to 10 minutes. Any passengers going to the city will be essentially unaffected by this closure.

By your logic Jonno, we should open bus stops everywhere to encourage pax to catch PT more. ::)

There are considerable network advantages to getting rid of Dutton Park - principally that all services Fairfield and south can use the tunnel, which creates more capacity for Cleveland trains and a faster journey time.  Will also allow Park Road to be reconfigured to get rid of the curvature, reduce the number of platforms to what is actually needed, and eliminate junction conflicts by sending the crossing trains underneath.  I can see no reason why you would need to run any trains from south of Fairfield via South Bank any longer with UBAT, which is a small advantage over CRR.

I think by 2050 you will still have Fairfield via South Bank trains - otherwise you are asking UBAT to carry all rail capacity from Beenleigh, Flagstone and the Gold Coast.

In the short-term, UBAT is great, long term it may cause issues (especially with respect to things like sectorisation).
Is it really that hard to run frequent, reliable public transport?

Offline SurfRail

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #19 on: November 28, 2013, 12:23:34 PM »
I think by 2050 you will still have Fairfield via South Bank trains - otherwise you are asking UBAT to carry all rail capacity from Beenleigh, Flagstone and the Gold Coast.

I can't see why this would be an issue.  At 24tph that would be more than double the current requirement, and if they do the sensible thing and plan for 9-car sets you get another 50% capacity on top of that.  The rail network would need to be carrying 3 times more than it does now for this to be an issue even with 6 car sets.

If there is ever a need to run more than 24tph (eg if the Beenleigh line ever needs to be tiered, which I doubt), the all-stations service originating from say Kuraby could operate via South Bank. 
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Offline James

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #20 on: November 28, 2013, 01:16:23 PM »
I can't see why this would be an issue.  At 24tph that would be more than double the current requirement, and if they do the sensible thing and plan for 9-car sets you get another 50% capacity on top of that.  The rail network would need to be carrying 3 times more than it does now for this to be an issue even with 6 car sets.

If there is ever a need to run more than 24tph (eg if the Beenleigh line ever needs to be tiered, which I doubt), the all-stations service originating from say Kuraby could operate via South Bank.

Each line then only gets 8tph in peak. GC Line by 2050 will be wanting 8tph minimum I'd say, leaving 8tph for both Beenleigh and Flagstone, which won't be adequate. It also gives the Cleveland Line 24tph - far more than it needs.

My personal opinion is that 9-car trains should be reserved exclusively for interurban express runs (i.e. the original CoastLink concept). While the whole '9 car tilting rolling stock' idea is a bit foamy, I think that if we did the inter-urban express concept properly (i.e. dedicated tracks to Beenleigh/Caboolture, with it taking ~45 minutes to Helensvale/Beerwah from Roma Street), you could justify charging more for the service.

Right now, the current service is an awful milk-run Park Road - Beenleigh, and for that reason you can't charge a lot more for interurban travel. It also isn't competitive, either.
Is it really that hard to run frequent, reliable public transport?

Offline aldonius

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #21 on: November 28, 2013, 01:42:33 PM »
The trouble with all Beenleigh services using the tunnel is if the Park Rd connection doesn't come back.

That's why I support tiering the Beenleigh line from day 1 of tunnel operations.

Incidentally (since we have been getting fairly far-future and offtopic), if the infill Coast stations do proceed, and we have: inner-BL trains via Bridge, outer-BL trains express via tunnel, Coast trains express via tunnel, and Coast local trains; is Beenleigh necessarily the best place to have the switchover, as opposed to say Helensvale with the Light Rail connection?

Offline SurfRail

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #22 on: November 28, 2013, 01:48:56 PM »
^ Helensvale is the right spot if the line is extended to Coolangatta AND the infill stations are built, otherwise not much point.

You would have 4 patterns at this point - inner Beenleigh (to say Kuraby), outer Beenleigh and northern Gold Coast (to say Helensvale) and southern Gold Coast (to Coolangatta), plus Flagstone.  Cleveland line might have a permanent express pattern and a pattern originating at Manly, so one pattern would go over the bridge.

I still don't think the Beenleigh line needs tiering - the current solution from January 2014 seems much better.
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Offline aldonius

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #23 on: November 28, 2013, 02:00:44 PM »
OK then, I amend my support of tiering in the 'medium' term - long term I think Coolangatta and infill will happen - to only include the scenarios where there's no tunnel station at Park Rd.

If there is a tunnel station there then yes, all possible services should use the tunnel. The bridge should be well under capacity in that case, and once the tunnel hits capacity tiering can then be implemented for the inner BL line.

I think that covers everything.

Offline Gazza

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #24 on: November 28, 2013, 03:24:18 PM »
Quote
it has closest walking distance to UQ, my wife said she used to catch to DP then walk to river and ferry across.
Few would do that today compared to your wifes uni days, due to the Boggo Rd tunnel.

Offline Stillwater

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #25 on: November 28, 2013, 04:36:52 PM »
You would get rid of Dutton Park, for reasons stated above, with better pedestrian access to Park Road Station / bus station and (this is the crucial bit) if Park Road in a reconfiguration also served Beenleigh and GC trains.  That is the sensible thing to push for.  The 'save Dutton Park Station' campaign becomes a distraction that switches attention away from what is doable at Park Road.

Offline James

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #26 on: November 28, 2013, 06:44:32 PM »
DP stats
- 113th for AM boardings, 128 people
- 23rd for PM Boardings, 117 people

- 22nd for AM aligtings, 169 people
-106 for PM aligtings, 106 people

Would appear the station gets regular use through out the day but not lightly used.

Mid-term, DP and most of the inner nth stations should not be part of the scheduled BL train stops. They should be on the Kuraby 15min service. BL should miss these stops so not an excuse to cut the station.

DP is over 1km from PR and closer to 1.5km walking distance accroding to Google maps from either station along side.

it has closest walking distance to UQ, my wife said she used to catch to DP then walk to river and ferry across.

For inner city stations, close spacing is important as you get mostly walk up due to usually lower car ownership levels and limited parking if any at stations. Putting people on bus to city or bus/train option is not a smart way to retain users. If you are going to cut DP, why not go through and cut every station thats closer than 2km to another and while we are at it why is there even talk to put more stations on GC line, as this will jsut slow down trains.

Keep it!

Regards
Shane

It does well counter-peak because stations like Fruitgrove and Oxley practically get no counter-peak flow.

By rail, Park Road is 800m from Dutton Park station - that is, Dutton Park is in Park Road's catchment area! Back when the UQ Ferry existed, of course Dutton Park was popular. Now you'd be dumb to walk from Dutton Park, as there are buses going from Park Road every 15 minutes or better. Removing Dutton Park, you get a stop spacing of 2km. This is not unreasonable at all - distance between Toowong and Taringa is 1.6km, 1.7km Buranda - Coorparoo, 2.1km Morningside - Cannon Hill and probably the most identical example - the distance between Bowen Hills and Albion is 1.7km.

I support in-fill Gold Coast line stations, but have an express train which proceeds to the CBD which stops only at current GC line stations + Elanora/Coolangatta (no Varsity Lakes).
Is it really that hard to run frequent, reliable public transport?

Offline Jonno

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #27 on: November 28, 2013, 06:57:25 PM »
DP stats
- 113th for AM boardings, 128 people
- 23rd for PM Boardings, 117 people

- 22nd for AM aligtings, 169 people
-106 for PM aligtings, 106 people

Would appear the stationg gets regular use through out the day but not lightly used.

Mid-term, DP and most of the inner nth stations should not be part of the scheduled BL train stops. They should be on the Kuraby 15min service. BL should miss these stops so not an excuse to cut the station.

DP is over 1km from PR and closer to 1.5km walking distance accroding to Google maps from either station along side.

it has closest walking distance to UQ, my wife said she used to catch to DP then walk to river and ferry across.

For inner city stations, close spacing is important as you get mostly walk up due to usually lower car ownership levels and limited parking if any at stations. Putting people on bus to city or bus/train option is not a smart way to retain users. If you are going to cut DP, why not go through and cut every station thats closer than 2km to another and while we are at it why is there even talk to put more stations on GC line, as this will jsut slow down trains.

Keep it!

Regards
Shane

+1

Offline HappyTrainGuy

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #28 on: November 28, 2013, 07:04:07 PM »
I'm leaning to say close it but I would also like to see the plans (new ped bridges, pathways, cycleways, bus services to shift passengers on to, the tunnel alignment/interchange stations etc) on a map to fully justify why it should be closed or why it should be retained.
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Offline #Metro

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #29 on: November 28, 2013, 09:47:42 PM »
Quote
DP stats
- 113th for AM boardings, 128 people
- 23rd for PM Boardings, 117 people

- 22nd for AM aligtings, 169 people
-106 for PM aligtings, 106 people

Would appear the stationg gets regular use through out the day but not lightly used.

I think this really is status quo bias. Let's say 200 people use DP station. One QR train fits 1000 pax at load, the pax at dutton park fill just over ONE train carriage.

On a second point, the people who would no longer be able to use Dutton Pk station would switch to alternatives (after screaming and yelling blue murder and how they will leave PT forever blah blah) such as the busway or catching a train to Park Road. We need to consider this change - for every action there is a REaction.

Other posters on this forum are correct on one point though. Assuming all GC and Beenleigh trains travel up Campbell's BUM, pax on the Beenleigh line will not be able to access PA hospital, unless they transferred to a service like the 100 BUZ or backtracked at Wooloongabba. Why? Because with no interchange station at Park Road, the only other stations would be Fairfield (too far) or Wooloongabba (too far, backtrack required). This is an important point. Perhaps they would have to detrain at Fairfield or Yeronga and get the 196 BUZ for this.

I don't believe the station should stay. Does it really make sense to hold up $3BN project over 1 train carriage of pax, most of who already have alternatives???

Failing to route all Beenleigh and GC trains into the BUM will mean that the net present value and benefit cost ratio of the project will be significantly affected (negatively) as the time savings would be lost if via South Bank services were retained. It would also create a mess.
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Offline ozbob

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #30 on: November 29, 2013, 03:55:23 AM »
Couriermail Quest --> Proposed Dutton Park train station closure sparks access fears for Princess Alexandra Hospital patients
Half baked projects, have long term consequences ...
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Offline #Metro

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #31 on: November 29, 2013, 06:56:43 AM »
OMG, more fear campaigns starting again.  :frs: :fp:
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Offline Jonno

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #32 on: November 29, 2013, 07:20:03 AM »
There is plenty wrong with this project. Dutton Park is just one of many concerns.  In terms of affording CCR Lite, the State Government will fund freeway expansion worth far more with the only outcome being more congestion and a bigger economic damage.  State can afford CCR Lite in a heart beat ...if they believed that building more roads only deepens the economic damage of car usage.  They are still living in "Balanced Approach" land where active and public transport is not seen as a burden that is being forced on them rather than betters modes of transport economically, physically, socially and environmentally.

Offline #Metro

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #33 on: November 29, 2013, 01:16:29 PM »
Quote
the State Government will fund freeway expansion worth far more
Which freeway is this?
Negative people... have a problem for every solution.
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Offline Jonno

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #34 on: November 29, 2013, 01:21:47 PM »
Gateway, M1, Bruce around Caboolture/Caloundra

Offline Jonno

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #35 on: November 29, 2013, 01:22:23 PM »
Oh and Ipswich Mtrway & & &

Offline #Metro

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #36 on: November 29, 2013, 02:27:00 PM »
Quote
Gateway, M1, Bruce around Caboolture/Caloundra, Ipswich Mtrway.


The usual suspects. Bruce Hwy is OK and places distant you do need a car.
Road pricing is what is needed.
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Offline Jonno

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #37 on: November 29, 2013, 03:32:21 PM »
Govt stop believing that the can fix congestion or cater for population growth by building more roads is all that is needed. 

Offline Gazza

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #38 on: November 29, 2013, 03:35:02 PM »
One thing that nobody has mentioned, but even if Dutton Park could be retained, wouldn't it be shut for at least a couple of years while portal works take place?

In which case, what are all the patients gonna do then?

Offline nathandavid88

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Re: Dutton Park Station - Your opinion is required.
« Reply #39 on: November 29, 2013, 03:48:06 PM »
One thing that nobody has mentioned, but even if Dutton Park could be retained, wouldn't it be shut for at least a couple of years while portal works take place?

In which case, what are all the patients gonna do then?

Go up to Park Road I suspect...

 

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